Thank you so much for this! I don't know what I would do without my Dutch ovens. I bought my first one when I was initially learning about bread making. I knew it was ideal because of the steam situation, but it's great to learn a little more about what's truly going on in there. It's funny... we have a vintage bus that we converted into an RV to travel in for part of the year and we literally spend hours configuring the drawers to find the perfect Dutch oven storage spot because it is a MUST, even when we're on the road! (And it works great in our bus' convection oven.)
I've been using a cast iron rib roaster (Broil King 69615 Cast Iron Rib Roaster on Amazon) to bake a "loaf-shaped" loaf. I make the batch 33% larger relative to a loaf designed for a dutch oven.
I use a Forneau Oven which frees me from the constraints (round loaves and one loaf at a time) that are listed above. Also no handling heavy hot lids or removing the bulk mass of hot cast iron from the oven. You can even make a slightly short epi baguette.
Benjamin - Thanks for reminding me of the Forneau, I'd forgotten about them. It looks like they are unavailable, but there's a new one in the works. Will have to test one out someday.
So I just discovered that I am not supposed to preheat empty enameled dutch oven pans? I have been successfully using my smaller Le Creuset to make my loaves with the hot start method, but just got nervous that I have damaged/could damage my pot if I continued... Do you have any specific advice on that? I picked up a Lodge combo cooker just in case!
Kathleen - Who told you that? Everyone does it and it's just fine! Over time it will darken in color, but it has no effect on the use of the pot itself (and the stain can be removed by soaking it in a dilute bleach solution).
Great article, lots of helpful info here. One addition: I've also found that the inverted-vessel-atop-baking stone (not steel) works great, but especially great when an ice cube or two are placed directly on the stone before covering with your vessel to really pack the void with steam for that initial spring. Melting cubes function better on a completely flat (and porous / absorbent) stone than they do inside a vessel like an enameled DO with rounded edges that risk water pooling under your loaf and creating a weird bottom crust. Typically I add two cubes when I load the loaf, and one more about ten minutes in. These tweaks and many of the ones you mention have been a breakthrough for my final loaf height and that beautiful real burst-open look cascading from the score.
I've always found that instructions for sourdough baking are dramatically lacking in detail around the score and the especially the bake, which have an immense impact on your final result (if you lean perfectionist like me). Much appreciate the detail you've contributed.
Tyler - interesting. I'll have to try that next time I bake under a large pan, where there's room for an ice cube or two without it touching the bread.
Great article. When you check oven spring after 15-20 minutes, how do you know if it’s time to remove the lid or go longer? I’ve just been following what the timer tells me to do.
Claire - It's just something you know from experience, but I'm looking for maximum expansion in the cuts and a rounded, fat shape overall. You can always put the lid on and let it go for another 5 minutes or so. If you don't see a change after that, then remove the lid. It becomes second nature after awhile.
I love learning the "Why?" after using the method so successfully for a while--thanks! When you turn on the convection fan, do you need to adjust the temperature?
Dessa - I generally do not, but I keep a close eye on the bread, since it can get dark fast. I usually set my timer for 5 or 10 minute intervals to be safe.
I recently treated myself to a bread sling (https://www.breadsling.com/). It works pretty well, but only for loaves up to about 600 g of flour.
Speaking of cold start...I've found that it produces better oven spring for me for pan loaves than hot start. I haven't tested it rigorously, but I'm pretty sure this is true. Have you experienced this or experimented with it?
Allen - I find the combo cooker a little small for my needs, I wish they made a full sized (~8 quart) version. The bread sling looks cool, thanks for the tip. I can see why a cold start might indeed give better oven spring (longer/slower), but IME the difference is negligible enough that the loss in crust quality isn't worth it. Also, I forgot to mention that my loaves are more likely to burn on the bottom with a cold start, since all the heat is concentrated on the bottom of the pot.
Time to ditch lava rocks! I've been doing it ever since I bought a lame in combination with a large upside-down bowl (KAB's technique). Lava rocks ARE fussy, and I have a gas oven so there's no point. I'm going to retire them as mulch for my plants and start using just the bowl or a dutch oven.
Nope. Most modern electric ovens are sealed, thought they do sometimes have heat exchanger vents. Gas ovens, since they involve combustion, require venting for O2/CO2 exchange.
With respect, are you sure? A quick review of the first half dozen owners manuals on ABT and wolf suggest that electric ovens have air inlets and exhaust vents. Not sure what a heat exchanger vent is but if it lets hot air out, surely it lets steam out too. I’m not questioning the superiority of a Dutch oven set up for steaming but wondering if a tight seal is really necessary to steam a home oven. If yes, then there’s a lot of crummy advice out there about oven steaming set ups.
Perhaps I overstated the point. Electric ovens do vent _a little_, mainly/ironically to prevent steam buildup for proper browning. But it is just a small vent, especially compared to gas ovens, which are practically open to the atmosphere. In any case, that only means that it's hard to retain steam no matter what style of oven you have. If you find you can get your oven to retain enough steam to give results as good as a DO, then by all means you should. Like I said, I don't think it's worth the hassle, personally.
Thanks! I have a gas oven and I totally don’t have any luck steaming loaves without a Dutch oven. But I was assuming it was a failure on my part and not a gap in the logic of steaming advice offered by the bread cognoscenti. Very grateful for your article and the info.
This answered a lot of questions that were starting to pop into my mind as I become more comfortable with sourdough! (I've been with you since Day 1 of Quarantiny!)
The only question I have is, do you have any recommendations on how to remove the loaf from a Dutch oven (standard Le Creuset) once it has completed the steaming phase? I'm worried I will damage the crust that has formed if I invert it and I'm not sure the parchment is strong enough at that point to lift the loaf.
Great read. I use a baking stone that fits the width and depth of my oven. I then use the top of a cloche to create the dutch oven effect. Once that loaf has baked for 15-20 minutes, I lift it off and put in a new loaf. Lather, rinse, repeat.
I've been baking breads with a Dutch oven for a few years but was often underwhelmed by the uneven baking of the bread's side, after removing the lid. Removing the bread after the first 20 min and using convection was *chef's kiss*. Thanks
I want to bake several loaves as holiday gifts but my two Dutch ovens won't fit in my oven at the same time. You mention taking the first loaf out to brown on the rack while putting a second loaf in the Dutch oven to spring. Does the second (and third, etc.) loaf cook well enough even though I've lowered the oven temp from 475* to 425*? I tried leaving the oven at 475* last night but my first loaf got too brown. Second question, I have a convection fan but have never used it. Do you adjust the oven temp when you turn on the fan?
Dessa - I think I answered this above already, but no, when I'm doing staggered baking, I do not lower the oven temp, I just watch the browning loaf carefully, especially if I'm using the convection fan. (I do sometimes lower the oven temp _just_enough_ to get the lower element to turn off, if I'm worried about burning.) Lately I've been putting the finishing loaf on a mini baking stone to shield it from the lower element a bit. A cast iron skillet would probably work in a similar way too.
Thank you so much for this! I don't know what I would do without my Dutch ovens. I bought my first one when I was initially learning about bread making. I knew it was ideal because of the steam situation, but it's great to learn a little more about what's truly going on in there. It's funny... we have a vintage bus that we converted into an RV to travel in for part of the year and we literally spend hours configuring the drawers to find the perfect Dutch oven storage spot because it is a MUST, even when we're on the road! (And it works great in our bus' convection oven.)
I've been using a cast iron rib roaster (Broil King 69615 Cast Iron Rib Roaster on Amazon) to bake a "loaf-shaped" loaf. I make the batch 33% larger relative to a loaf designed for a dutch oven.
I use a Forneau Oven which frees me from the constraints (round loaves and one loaf at a time) that are listed above. Also no handling heavy hot lids or removing the bulk mass of hot cast iron from the oven. You can even make a slightly short epi baguette.
Benjamin - Thanks for reminding me of the Forneau, I'd forgotten about them. It looks like they are unavailable, but there's a new one in the works. Will have to test one out someday.
So I just discovered that I am not supposed to preheat empty enameled dutch oven pans? I have been successfully using my smaller Le Creuset to make my loaves with the hot start method, but just got nervous that I have damaged/could damage my pot if I continued... Do you have any specific advice on that? I picked up a Lodge combo cooker just in case!
Kathleen - Who told you that? Everyone does it and it's just fine! Over time it will darken in color, but it has no effect on the use of the pot itself (and the stain can be removed by soaking it in a dilute bleach solution).
Great article, lots of helpful info here. One addition: I've also found that the inverted-vessel-atop-baking stone (not steel) works great, but especially great when an ice cube or two are placed directly on the stone before covering with your vessel to really pack the void with steam for that initial spring. Melting cubes function better on a completely flat (and porous / absorbent) stone than they do inside a vessel like an enameled DO with rounded edges that risk water pooling under your loaf and creating a weird bottom crust. Typically I add two cubes when I load the loaf, and one more about ten minutes in. These tweaks and many of the ones you mention have been a breakthrough for my final loaf height and that beautiful real burst-open look cascading from the score.
I've always found that instructions for sourdough baking are dramatically lacking in detail around the score and the especially the bake, which have an immense impact on your final result (if you lean perfectionist like me). Much appreciate the detail you've contributed.
Tyler - interesting. I'll have to try that next time I bake under a large pan, where there's room for an ice cube or two without it touching the bread.
Great article. When you check oven spring after 15-20 minutes, how do you know if it’s time to remove the lid or go longer? I’ve just been following what the timer tells me to do.
Claire - It's just something you know from experience, but I'm looking for maximum expansion in the cuts and a rounded, fat shape overall. You can always put the lid on and let it go for another 5 minutes or so. If you don't see a change after that, then remove the lid. It becomes second nature after awhile.
I love learning the "Why?" after using the method so successfully for a while--thanks! When you turn on the convection fan, do you need to adjust the temperature?
Dessa - I generally do not, but I keep a close eye on the bread, since it can get dark fast. I usually set my timer for 5 or 10 minute intervals to be safe.
Lowering the raw loaf is always tricky for me. I wish I had purchased a combo cooker (https://www.lodgecastiron.com/product/cast-iron-combo-cooker?sku=LCC3) instead of a traditional Dutch oven.
I recently treated myself to a bread sling (https://www.breadsling.com/). It works pretty well, but only for loaves up to about 600 g of flour.
Speaking of cold start...I've found that it produces better oven spring for me for pan loaves than hot start. I haven't tested it rigorously, but I'm pretty sure this is true. Have you experienced this or experimented with it?
Allen - I find the combo cooker a little small for my needs, I wish they made a full sized (~8 quart) version. The bread sling looks cool, thanks for the tip. I can see why a cold start might indeed give better oven spring (longer/slower), but IME the difference is negligible enough that the loss in crust quality isn't worth it. Also, I forgot to mention that my loaves are more likely to burn on the bottom with a cold start, since all the heat is concentrated on the bottom of the pot.
Time to ditch lava rocks! I've been doing it ever since I bought a lame in combination with a large upside-down bowl (KAB's technique). Lava rocks ARE fussy, and I have a gas oven so there's no point. I'm going to retire them as mulch for my plants and start using just the bowl or a dutch oven.
Actually, lowering bread into a dutch oven seems dangerous and I like the motion of peeling something into the oven so i’m sticking with a bowl.
Don’t electric ovens vent too?
Nope. Most modern electric ovens are sealed, thought they do sometimes have heat exchanger vents. Gas ovens, since they involve combustion, require venting for O2/CO2 exchange.
With respect, are you sure? A quick review of the first half dozen owners manuals on ABT and wolf suggest that electric ovens have air inlets and exhaust vents. Not sure what a heat exchanger vent is but if it lets hot air out, surely it lets steam out too. I’m not questioning the superiority of a Dutch oven set up for steaming but wondering if a tight seal is really necessary to steam a home oven. If yes, then there’s a lot of crummy advice out there about oven steaming set ups.
Perhaps I overstated the point. Electric ovens do vent _a little_, mainly/ironically to prevent steam buildup for proper browning. But it is just a small vent, especially compared to gas ovens, which are practically open to the atmosphere. In any case, that only means that it's hard to retain steam no matter what style of oven you have. If you find you can get your oven to retain enough steam to give results as good as a DO, then by all means you should. Like I said, I don't think it's worth the hassle, personally.
Thanks! I have a gas oven and I totally don’t have any luck steaming loaves without a Dutch oven. But I was assuming it was a failure on my part and not a gap in the logic of steaming advice offered by the bread cognoscenti. Very grateful for your article and the info.
This answered a lot of questions that were starting to pop into my mind as I become more comfortable with sourdough! (I've been with you since Day 1 of Quarantiny!)
The only question I have is, do you have any recommendations on how to remove the loaf from a Dutch oven (standard Le Creuset) once it has completed the steaming phase? I'm worried I will damage the crust that has formed if I invert it and I'm not sure the parchment is strong enough at that point to lift the loaf.
Thank you for literally EVERYTHING!
I use grilling gloves to lift out the loaf.
How would you compare a clay baker to a cast iron Dutch oven?
Clay bakers are great too, they work similarly well to a cast iron pot.
Have you ever sealed a Dutch oven with a piece of aluminum foil?
No, but I think it would work fine, Jonny.
Great read. I use a baking stone that fits the width and depth of my oven. I then use the top of a cloche to create the dutch oven effect. Once that loaf has baked for 15-20 minutes, I lift it off and put in a new loaf. Lather, rinse, repeat.
Bingo.
I've been baking breads with a Dutch oven for a few years but was often underwhelmed by the uneven baking of the bread's side, after removing the lid. Removing the bread after the first 20 min and using convection was *chef's kiss*. Thanks
I want to bake several loaves as holiday gifts but my two Dutch ovens won't fit in my oven at the same time. You mention taking the first loaf out to brown on the rack while putting a second loaf in the Dutch oven to spring. Does the second (and third, etc.) loaf cook well enough even though I've lowered the oven temp from 475* to 425*? I tried leaving the oven at 475* last night but my first loaf got too brown. Second question, I have a convection fan but have never used it. Do you adjust the oven temp when you turn on the fan?
Dessa - I think I answered this above already, but no, when I'm doing staggered baking, I do not lower the oven temp, I just watch the browning loaf carefully, especially if I'm using the convection fan. (I do sometimes lower the oven temp _just_enough_ to get the lower element to turn off, if I'm worried about burning.) Lately I've been putting the finishing loaf on a mini baking stone to shield it from the lower element a bit. A cast iron skillet would probably work in a similar way too.